Struts or Box Strainers

[Green Man]

Hi Fellow Fencers

 

I'm new to the forum just like to say looks a really friendly site. Some sites I have been on in the past people are afraid to share info but this is the opposite well done.

 

I would like to know what peoples preferences are regarding the above with Labour/Time and cost what do you guys do.

 

I look at alot of the Kiwis work on the interweb and most of it is struts but over here I think im right in saying most of it is box strainers certainly in East Anglia anyway

 

TIA

 

Carl

[Goaty]

Welcome. Yes overall a good site, mostly we get on and accept differences.

As ive mentioned somewhere. Boxes ate thr method thats best. Better posts tend to be used.

 

 

 

Many of the braces ive done have rotted out. The damp near ground level conditions along with open cuts on braces with less effective timber treatment. I reckon for the time being braces have had it.

Go to a fencing çompetition and time the lads how long it takes. Then aim gor that!

[Matt on the Moors]

Goaty is right, I used to do struts, don't bother any more. I find box strainers better and more stable in just about every ground condition over angled strut. I used to brace my struts off a big rock (i live in a rocky area!) that I would bury deep in the ground and then bang the strut down wedging it tightly against the rock, it was all well and good but by the time I had dug the whole for the rock,found a suitable rock and mortise the strut etc I could have done the full on box strainer.

 

I have never liked seeing an angled strut braced of a post, cut timber on the strut and any rotting will quickly fail the fence.

[premnayloon]

Ah time for me to contribute.

Up here I would say 95% of stays are angled.

The way I do them. Is labour intensive. But I feel they look good and the basic laws of physics says they have to work. I've never had ground yet that they don't work on.

 

I always creosote my mortice in the strainer. So rotting there for me isn't an issue.

 

I think I'm the only one on here who does it my method.

Although red stag has used it now and again.

( but don't tell him I told you????)

[Matt on the Moors]

Quite a few round here do a fairly low angled strut with a retaining wire too a bit like a combination of a box strut and angled strut. I must say it's a very strong method whilst the timber is good. Forestry commission do it like this too, FC did a load of fencing nearby recently and I was quite surprised how good a job they did.

[premnayloon]

I'm not a fan of wiring the angled stays. Never have been for me its not right.

[Green Man]

Cheers guys some good comments do any of you use what I call a half box strainer so the second post is cut to the height of the brace. 

 

Also i was thinking of speeding my box strainers up by using the gripple gpak never used them and not sure on cost.

[HullFencing]

personally i prefer to box on, provides a much stronger brace in my opinion but i will use a strut on a change of direction if it requires bracing due to the time saving involved. 

 

Im not all the keen on the cut down boxes as to me it leaves a lot of cut/exposed timber with i would have thought would shorten life - must admit they look good when done well though. 

 

Not tried gpaks yet, have been tempted to give them a go in the past though. 

[RCCM]

Hi there,

 

As most others here will agree, full height boxes are the best form of support. I can build one in the same time as an angled Strutt, as I find cutting the angles and mortice neatly and correctly is quite time consuming as well as getting the strutt and stob tight.

 

I can drive the second post of the box in and know that the horizontal brace or Strutt will always be tight and I can carve out a mortice with my carving saw using the jigs I have for marking, quicker than fitting a normal Strutt. I use a small dewalt laser measurer to put in the back of the mortice and shine it at the back of the other mortice to give me the exact length of the post/Strutt which makes it possible to do on your own instead of trying to hold a wobbly tape measure especially on deer fencing.

 

The only difference in cost, is an extra post but a lighter shorter strainer can be used. The amount of 2.5mm ht line wire used for the stay or brace wire is minimal and either a crimp or gripple to tension. I don't like gripples personally, and instead always use crimps and then a couple of wraps on eac end wit the tail and then do your breaks.

 

G PAKS are a complete waste of time and money. Gripple tools seem to shred the gpak cable very easily too. Use 2.5mm HT wrapped twice round.

 

Doing it this way they never seem to move or the stay wire go slack. I have visited boxes years later and the stay wire is still super taught.

 

My latest deer height boxes use a 3.6m machine round pole and I have a 100mm forstner bit in my petrol drill which creates the best fit imaginable and the most contact/bearing surface possible.

 

Most of my fencing is deer fencing. So all of it is a box of one description or another. I do use half height boxes with a stout deer intermediate for the inline strainer just driven much deeper and another for the horizontal strutt. They are pretty strong but not like a full height box.

 

They are sometimes useful to support a turn post built sticking out exactly half of the change in direction.

 

Usually i use half height boxes to exclude deer and proper full height boxes to keep them in.

[West Fork Fence]

We only build box braces, or H braces as they are known here.  The Gripple quick braces are great.......we make our own and sell them.  On a fence job, we still use 5/16" galvanized cable, but simply run a figure 8 and join and tension with a large Gripple.  Instead of a morticed horizontal, we simply use 3/8" galvanized brace pins to hold the strut in place.  It's a 3 minute job once the posts are in the ground.   There are plenty of places in the US where welded pipe braces are the norm, but in our high moisture area, pipe won't hold or last very long. 

[Green Man]

RCCM Thanks for the advice on GPAKS I think i will stick to the method which is the same as yours twice round with 2.5 HT.

 

Going back to box Strainers and strength to instal my half box strainers the second post is 2.4 long and I bang them into the ground until only 500mm is out ground would this make it stronger than a box strainer. The only disadvantage is the cut wood which i always treat.

[Markhibberdfencing]

RCCM Thanks for the advice on GPAKS I think i will stick to the method which is the same as yours twice round with 2.5 HT.

 

Going twice round with 2.5 Ht is the minimum of what I now do before I knew any better only went round once but thanks to forums every day is now a school day. NZF suggested good practice in nz is four times round with 2.5 ht or three times with 3.15 ht much still to learn. Rob bishop showed me how to go round in a figure of eight which I like and now practice

[Green Man]

RCCM Thanks for the advice on GPAKS I think i will stick to the method which is the same as yours twice round with 2.5 HT.

 

Going twice round with 2.5 Ht is the minimum of what I now do before I knew any better only went round once but thanks to forums every day is now a school day. NZF suggested good practice in nz is four times round with 2.5 ht or three times with 3.15 ht much still to learn. Rob bishop showed me how to go round in a figure of eight which I like and now practice

I haven't seen that before all the guys round here are twice round or GPak 4 must be a ****** to tighten.

[Markhibberdfencing]

I have tried going round four times and tightened up good but I did feel it was overkill but I'm sure there are situations where it needs to be done, the 3.15 is quite a challenge but once done a few times becomes easier.

[RCCM]

Doing a figure of 8 with your stay wire on the box is more dangerous to stock. We had a deer caught up in the upper part of the 8 on a box someone else had done. If you do an open loop, they just slide down to the bottom.

[tepapa]

3 loops of 2.5 ht or 2 loops of 3.15 ht is adequate for boxes, 4 is over kill but dont use gripples, i know there quick and easy but there is too much tension on the wire for gripples to hold when stressed. G paks are useless, the wire breaks too easily as the gripple bites into it.

[tepapa]

Two loops of 2.5 ht isn't adequate, there is still too much tension in the brace wires and needs the extra turn to reduce the stress. 3.15 is ok at two loops though and comparable in strength to 3x 2.5mm ht.

[Green Man]

Two loops of 2.5 ht isn't adequate, there is still too much tension in the brace wires and needs the extra turn to reduce the stress. 3.15 is ok at two loops though and comparable in strength to 3x 2.5mm ht.

Thanks tepapa 

 

 

 

Going back to box Strainers and strength. The half box strainers that I do the second post is 2.4 long and I bang them into the ground until only 500mm is out ground would this make it stronger than a traditional box strainer because of the depth of second post.

[tepapa]

It will make it stronger but probably unnecessary. The forces through a box is trying to push the second strainer down into the ground which i very much doubt will happen if its 1.9m into the ground to start with. The inline strainer is just there to take the force from the top of the strainer down to the bottom where it has ground contact. A 5-6" six foot post is probably enough if your driving it down to 500mm and use the money saved to beef up the strainer size.